Growth In Reverse

AUDIO - 008 Justin Moore v1
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[00:00:00] Chenell Basilio: When you had a 3, 000 person email list, you sold a 2, 000 sponsorship deal. And I was like, what?

[00:00:07] Justin Moore: In a two week span, we got 30, 000 people to sign up for our email list. And we were just like, Oh, is that good? Awesome. Like we were just so ignorant. We had no idea. Right. Of the 30, 000 people that we sent that to only 1, 000 opted back in.

And that was like a dagger to the heart. Everything was like, okay, you probably didn't know sound effects were coming. Did you?

[00:00:28] Chenell Basilio: I did.

[00:00:28] Justin Moore: Maybe you did though. Maybe you did though. I

[00:00:30] Chenell Basilio: was ready.

[00:00:31] Justin Moore: I just fundamentally don't look at this stuff transactionally. He basically said, okay, Justin, now is the time you have planted a million great seeds with people over the last, you know, four years.

Now is the time over the last several months. I've also had a significant churn issue. I'm basically filling the bucket, but I have a big hole in the bottom of the bucket. The visual that I like to give is like a lot of people think that negotiating with a brand or interacting with a brand, it's like you're on opposite sides of a table and it's contentious.

Imagine you [00:01:00] scoot your little swivel office chair around the side of the table. You're both sitting on the same side and you're looking at a whiteboard together.

[00:01:06] Chenell Basilio: You just made so many introverts cringe right now.

All right, I am excited. Today we have Justin Moore. Justin is a sponsorship coach for creators. He's been working with brands and has been a creator himself since 2009. His wife April had a YouTube channel and Justin was behind the scenes helping her with her brand deals. He then launched an agency helping brands.

Find creators to partner with, but now solely focuses on helping creators land their dream partnerships. Justin has brought in over 5 million in sponsorships, and he's on a mission to help creators land 1 million sponsorships by 2032. He has a book coming out called Sponsor Magnet, January 21st, and a new conference called Sponsor Games in March that I'm super excited for.

Welcome to the show, Justin.

[00:01:53] Justin Moore: Let's go. Excited to be here, y'all. Thanks for having me.

[00:01:56] Chenell Basilio: Yeah, I'm excited to have you to, um, so before we [00:02:00] dig into the growth of the newsletter sponsorships, all the good stuff, I wanted to ask you, like, in the beginning, you were working with April. She had a successful YouTube channel.

You guys were doing good things. You had this agency that was humming along. Like, what made you start a newsletter and YouTube channel in the first place?

[00:02:17] Justin Moore: Well, I can share a story, a horror story, actually. Um, because, um, we started a newsletter early on April and I actually, so we actually tried to launch a paid membership years ago.

This was in 2013. So way back in the day before, like monetization was, was really popular. A company actually approached us. So the story goes is that, um, we would do these videos on YouTube where it was like relationship advice. So we would talk about our own relationship, our views on that and all that.

And these videos. Pop man, they were getting, you know, hundreds of thousands of views every video. This is like in our heyday. Um, and this company approached us and was like, Hey, like we, we should make a paid membership, uh, all around, like helping people improve their relationships and like being able to [00:03:00] like get on calls and like help people through problems and stuff.

And, and we, we love the idea. We thought it was awesome. We loved, you know, being able to, you know, we got so many DMS and emails from people who have said that the advice that we gave them helped their relationship and all that. And so, um. As part of this process of launching the paid membership, the company advised us to start a newsletter.

They were like, okay, let's, let's, uh, you know, put up a lead magnet. And I think we, we created like an exclusive video, which was like, at the time it was like a house tour or like an apartment tour. 'cause we'd never done that. We'd never shown that. And people were like, oh, we wanna know where you live. And because we were like vloggers, right?

And Creator Wizard crib. Yeah, yeah. Creator Wizard crib style. Like, you know, you, you'd gotta stay here, but you gotta get the heck out or whatever. Um, but so this was crazy. And at the time we didn't realize it was crazy, but in a two week span, we got 30, 000 people to sign up for our email list in two weeks and we were just like, Oh, is that good?

Awesome. Like we were just so ignorant. We had no idea. Right? And and so, um, I'll spare you the gory details, but the paid membership ultimately [00:04:00] didn't work. Uh, our community turned on us for trying to launch something paid. It was awful. Actually, it was, it was, that's a whole another story. Um, but what happened was that we stopped sending emails to that Newsletter because we stopped the community, it didn't, or the membership, it didn't work.

And so about six years later, seven years later, we decided we're like, wow, we're sitting on this email list of like 30, 000 people. I feel like we should maybe start sending stuff to this again, like probably. Right. And so we sent a re engagement campaign to say, Hey, you haven't heard from us in seven years.

Uh, do you still want to hear from us? And, uh, of the 30, 000 people that we sent that to only 1, 000. Opted back in and that was like a dagger to the heart and it just made me think wow What what could have happened had we nurtured all these people over the last six or seven years? What could that have turned into and so when I decided to ultimately launch?

Creator wizard I knew that I was never gonna make that same mistake again And so I was I made a really concerted effort to nurture it from the beginning

[00:04:58] Chenell Basilio: That's crazy. I mean, I know you [00:05:00] started this newsletter in like the middle of 2020 and now it has 35, 000. So exactly.

[00:05:08] Justin Moore: Yeah.

[00:05:09] Chenell Basilio: Wow. That's a, definitely a good lesson.

[00:05:12] Justin Moore: Yeah. It also made me realize people like my wife way more than me. That's like, that's another lesson.

[00:05:19] Chenell Basilio: That's crazy. Um, so with this newsletter, when you started it, um, it was kind of humbling along, you were doing some, what I called unscalable things in the deep dive I wrote. Like one on one DMs, like every time someone followed you on social, that was pretty interesting.

Um, did that work really well or was that just like, Dude, the

[00:05:36] Justin Moore: one, the one on ones worked super well, like the DMing people. Cause I, I would did it not only on, it was Twitter back then, but on X. I, that worked really well, but also Instagram and TikTok. I did it everywhere. Anytime anyone followed me anywhere.

I would dm them and I will first I had a criteria so I would look at their profile to see does it say like youtuber in their bio or creator or I [00:06:00] look at their content. It seems like they're like an aspiring creator and I would say maybe about 50 percent of the people that followed me fit that.

Criteria. Um, and so every day I would, I would spend, you know, 30 minutes, an hour, basically, like just going through and dm'ing people. And the success rate was super high of people opting into the newsletter. And so in the early days, that was a really effective tactic.

[00:06:19] Chenell Basilio: Do you still talk to any of those people that you dm'd?

[00:06:21] Justin Moore: Yeah. I mean that, the other thing about that is that it opens up conversations when it's clear. Cause the other thing too, is I was personalizing the messages. I had like a template of course, but like I would. I would insert the person's name that this is so this would be really funny is that a lot of times people wouldn't have their first name in their bio and so I would click through to their YouTube channel and I would just like scrub through like 15 seconds of it and they'd be like, Hey, it's, you know, Jonathan or whatever.

Hey, it's Christy or whatever. And I would like get their name from watching a little bit of their content. And I would say that in the message and people have been like, Oh, wow. How did you know my name? I like don't have it on my Yeah. Profile anywhere. And so people I think would be genuinely surprised that I like took the effort to just [00:07:00] like find out what their name was.

[00:07:01] Chenell Basilio: That's fascinating.

[00:07:02] Justin Moore: Yeah, I mean, it's like extra effort, of course, but it like, you know, led to kind of some cool conversations. Yeah,

[00:07:08] Chenell Basilio: it's like that little extra piece that makes you stand out.

[00:07:11] Dylan Redekop: Obviously, people can't don't have the time to necessarily do all of the unscalable things. So what would you like looking back?

What do you think had the most impact of the of the methods you tried?

[00:07:21] Justin Moore: I really do think that one on one Outreach was super effective and actually some people screenshotted it and talked about it actually on X, which was interesting, which led to a little bit of like conversation, uh, around that tactic.

Um, I can't even remember who I like. I think I got that idea from someone doing it to me candidly, like maybe early on. And I was like, Oh, this is a good idea. I should do this. Um, So if I had to look back on, I did this thread a long time ago where it was like, here's how it got into 3000, uh, you know, uh, subscribers on my newsletter, which felt like a lot at the time.

And that this was one of the tactics that most, most people commented on. It was like, Oh wow, this is a good idea. I'm going to try this. And so like, I [00:08:00] honestly can't even remember the other nine, but that one is the one that I remember because it led to a lot of great conversations. That's awesome.

[00:08:06] Chenell Basilio: So I remember when doing the research, like early in the early days, you were talking not just about sponsorships.

You were talking about. All kinds of like how to do better content, how to grow an email list, all kinds of creator focused business topics. Um, and then over time you eventually like honed in on the sponsorship thing. So I'm curious, um, what's the story behind that? Like, how did you start with the focusing on sponsorship?

[00:08:30] Justin Moore: So the tagline for my YouTube channel, actually, when I first started was the business of being a creator that was like, because I love talking about that stuff, all the different aspects, you know, affiliate marketing and, you know, digital products and all that, um, and sponsorships, of course, because like, I had done that a lot.

Um, but. Every all the different. Basically, everything was just hold on. I got something. It was this. Everything was like, okay, you probably didn't know sound effects were coming. Did you? Um, I did. Or maybe you did know. Maybe you did. [00:09:00] Um, uh, but everything was just kind of blase. There was no, I would try to analyze which ones are performing better, but everything just kind of was, you know, not doing very well.

And so Um, however, I absolutely did notice that I had the most engagement, the most comments on videos about sponsorships. And in fact, one of my followers DM me a bit into the journey basically, who, and basically said, like, why are you talking about anything other than sponsorships? Like this, this seems like your, your wheelhouse.

Like, why, why are you, you should just stop talking about everything else. And I was like. That's a great idea. And so I just kind of made a hard pivot and I was like, okay, sponsorships. This is, this is the thing. This is all I'm going to do. And, and so I started making, you know, some only posting videos about sponsorships and those started to do better bet, like not like stratospherically better, but like better for sure.

Like then the baseline. Um, and so I just decided. It was [00:10:00] a, uh, kind of a gut thing. It wasn't like it was data backed per se. It wasn't like, Oh, this is clearly better. It was more just like, not only do I like talking about it more, but almost like now that I know this is the only thing that I'm going to focus on, it was so much clearer, like, wow, I can think about a hundred videos just about this topic, uh, versus like, you know, the, the best hits of like all these other various things.

And so I decided to hire. A content strategist, um, and I, my charge to him, his name is Alex. It's a great guy. You know, I was his first client. He had never worked with anyone, but it was just like a Twitter acquaintance. Um, and I said, Hey, I want to be known as the sponsorship guy on Twitter, on the internet.

Help me do that. And so we basically devised a playbook. Um, where I was like, okay, I'm going to be posting 10 times a day on Twitter, three times a day on Instagram. I'm going to be doing YouTube videos. I'm going to be doing the newsletter, you know, all this stuff. And so I worked with him for about two years and I think we nailed it.

Right? Like [00:11:00] literally, literally like anytime anyone on Twitter would say, Hey, I'm having an issue with sponsorships. You would open the thread and like eight people would tag me. Oh, talk to Justin. Talk to Justin. He's the guy. Yeah. Um, and so yeah, dude, yeah, it was, it was like a, uh, um, but, but again, it required kind of a full court press of content for a long time.

[00:11:20] Dylan Redekop: I think it worked.

[00:11:22] Chenell Basilio: I definitely say it worked.

[00:11:25] Dylan Redekop: Alex, Alex deserves a race. Nice.

[00:11:30] Chenell Basilio: And

[00:11:33] Justin Moore: he, and he, and Alex from steel club hat, you know, has grown his own. Business pretty significantly, um, on X and his own newsletter and stuff like that too. So yeah, I, uh, you know, we both kind of grew, grew together.

[00:11:44] Dylan Redekop: I think I just, I want to tie this, uh, do a full circle here because Justin, you and I and Chanel were all part of Jay's lab, um, community.

And two, almost three years ago, I was in that lab. Like, I don't know what to do with my newsletter. I'm just kind of talking about all this stuff. And, um, I had a hot seat with [00:12:00] Jay and you said, you watched the video afterwards and you just chimed in on a comment, Dylan, it seems like you should just talk about newsletters.

Like you're writing about newsletters. That's kind of like where your passion seems to be. Like, why don't you just like focus on like being like the newsletter about newsletters. And I was like. That's a good idea. I've kind of been thinking about that, but this is like definitely the validation that I need.

So I'm going to do that. And so that's like a full, a full, um, circle moment because that's what happened to you. You did it. That's what happened to me. And, um, so thank you for doing that. And, um, and yeah, it's just, that's the power of it.

[00:12:33] Justin Moore: Like equity in your business. Cause I am responsible for your, your wellbeing and your livelihood.

Is that yes, I'm hoping on some of

[00:12:39] Dylan Redekop: my debt.

[00:12:41] Justin Moore: I don't want any of the liabilities. I don't want any of the liabilities, just the equity. Okay. No, I'm, I'm, I'm stoked to hear that, man. Honestly, that, um, that that's, I didn't, I mean, I kind of knew that, but I didn't know quite the, that that was like the inflection point for you.

So that feels awesome, man. I'm stoked for you.

[00:12:57] Chenell Basilio: You're the DM guy now.

[00:12:58] Justin Moore: I'm the, I'm the DM [00:13:00] guy. Yeah. Look at that.

[00:13:02] Chenell Basilio: Amazing. Um, Justin, I feel like you speaking of relationships, you're just like extremely good at relationships with other creators, other people. Um, I joked in the deep dive I wrote. Uh, you and I can both walk into a room, you'll walk out with every single person's number and like potential partnerships with them.

I'll meet like one person, maybe get their like DM or something and you're just so good at this. And I think it's just led to a lot of the growth and it's all like behind the scenes stuff. Like people don't know all of the. Relationships that you've had and all of that back and work that you've done. Um, all they see is like the stuff on the outside.

So just kudos for that. Um, but also like, what kind of relationships do you find the most valuable? And, or do you just like go after anyone and everyone and just say like. Somebody might get some value from what I'm teaching. So let me just talk to every person I meet.

[00:13:53] Justin Moore: First of all, I appreciate that.

That's very, that's very kind of you. Um, I'll be totally honest. I definitely consider myself like a [00:14:00] gregarious person, like outgoing. I really, I feed off the energy of other people. Like that's just core core of my personality. And I understand not everyone's that way. Like there's more people. My, my wife's an introvert, like an introverted, an extroverted introvert is what she calls herself.

Right. Um, And, um, and so I very much enjoy talking to people and learning about them and learning about their business and learning about their problems and just like, I don't know, it's just like by part even in everyday life, making small talk with people. So I think that that is a default positive trait that helps me, uh, endear myself.

I think maybe to other people. Um, I think also part of it is that I'm not, I just fundamentally don't Look at this stuff transactionally, like I, one of the coolest parts, I think about growing the newsletter has been having the privilege of having a platform where I can shine a spotlight on other people and them and the cool stuff that they're doing.

And so even from the beginning, if someone was launching a product or launching a course or launching a community or launching something, I would just like DM them or respond, [00:15:00] Hey, you want me to like. Shout you out or like talk about you in the newsletter or like do this stuff too. And it was never like this, like secret scheme where like one day I'm gonna like come back quid pro quo.

Like, remember that time I mentioned you three years ago? Now it's time to pay up. You know, like I've never thought about it like that. It was always just like the inherent satisfaction I got of like helping someone. Um, and I think, I don't know. I think that that engendered a lot of goodwill. Um, for, for people, uh, you know, in the community to a point where, um, anytime they had a conversation with a friend who was having an issue, um, it just, it was like a natural thing, like, Oh, you got to like talk to this guy, Justin.

He's like focusing on this stuff. He's a good guy. He helped me out one time. Um, and so, yeah, of course, like it was, there was the, the by product of that was like, I think just like really positive word of mouth. Uh, and in fact, you could even bear that out in the, in the data of like my. Customers. Actually, my, my people who have joined my course or joined my coaching program, like something like 25 to 30 percent of those of people [00:16:00] who are joining our referrals, uh, from either affiliates, formal affiliates, or just like people like word of mouth saying, Oh, I heard about you from XYZ because I make a point, I make a point to ask people, how did you hear about me?

How did you hear about this program? This type of thing. And, and, um, it's, it's very often like, uh, from other people. And so. I like to think that success, financial success is a byproduct of service, uh, and just treating people well. Um, and so, um, I don't, and okay, this is the, you know, speaking of full circle, like, um, now that the, you know, the book is out, uh, I, I was faced with this very uncomfortable moment where I, you know, I was working with a book strategist and his name is Casey Proctor is a great guy.

Um, and he basically said, okay, Justin. Now is the time you have, you know, planted a million great seeds with people over the last, you know, four years. Now is the time to go and ask all these people. Hey, will you give me a shout out? Will you like talk, you know, share about the book much like I did to y'all, right?

I came and I said, Hey, y'all like would love to like come on the pod or newsletter, shout out, whatever. [00:17:00] Um, and it was super uncomfortable actually for me to like do this. Um, but of the basically a hundred people that I reached out to everyone, but three people. Said yes. And it was shocking. Like I was, I was, uh, and the three people who said no, it wasn't like, no, I hate you.

It was like, oh, I've pivoted the business. I'm not, you know, talking to creators anymore, whatever. Um, there was one person who was very icy. That was very uncomfortable. It was very weird and awkward. But, um, but yeah, the vast majority of people, it was just like, oh, no question. Like, you know, please, you know, and so, um, Yeah, it was, it was Casey put it in a new light.

He was like, you are actually, if you do not ask people, you are depriving them of being able to do you a solid. And like, you've helped me so much. I find a wow. I feel so awesome that I get to like, repay you for this advice. You gave me that one time that helped me make more money on a brand deal or whatever.

So, um, it was a really, it was a really fulfilling thing to like, reach out and ask people candidly.

[00:17:54] Chenell Basilio: That's awesome. It's got to feel good to know that like all of that hard work that you've put in is like people actually do respect [00:18:00] you for it and appreciate it enough to, I mean, it's a no brainer. Like having you on this is a no brainer.

One wrote a deep dive on you. I think it's awesome. Your story is great. And I think more people should learn about it. So,

[00:18:10] Justin Moore: well, first of all, thank you. But can I also share that I pestered Chanel? How many times did I pester you to write it? I was like, does this mean Chanel? That you're finally going to write a deep dive about me because I remember one time I saw you writing someone about someone that had less than 50, 000 followers.

And I was like, Oh, great. This is my ticket. Finally, so I think the next

[00:18:29] Chenell Basilio: morning I got a text from you. Like, when's my turn?

[00:18:32] Justin Moore: Yeah. So you have to speak this stuff into existence is what I is the point, right?

[00:18:36] Chenell Basilio: Yeah. Well, you also have to stop pruning your list. So aggressively. You've been at 35, 000 for like a year and a half now.

[00:18:44] Justin Moore: Okay. So, so can we, can, can this be the moment in the podcast where we talk about, uh, the problems, the challenges that I'm having with the newsletter? Let's

[00:18:50] Chenell Basilio: do it. Sure. Sure.

[00:18:52] Justin Moore: Because yes, I pruned the list. Um, but over the last several months, I've also had a significant [00:19:00] churn issue, um, where, um, I increased the cadence of the newsletter from basically one to two to three to now four times a week, and now it's a double edged sword because sales have definitely increased for the course because people are.

Just both the course and the coaching program, because people are just seeing the offers more. I mean, it's a real thing. Like, people are just, they're seeing, they're seeing the messaging and all that, but that also means that with every email, people are subscribing more and unsubscribing more. And it's not just, uh, a linear unsubscription.

It's. More aggressive than linear because, uh, people, there's just this general sense that like this dude is sending a lot of emails. Um, and so I have a problem, I think, generally, so, so I'm, I'm basically filling the bucket, but I have a big hole in the bottom of the bucket, and so I've been flat. Uh, in terms of the growth for the last couple of months.

And so, uh, can we workshop this? Like what, what do you, what would your guys [00:20:00] suggestions be to like fix this issue?

[00:20:03] Dylan Redekop: Oh, well, a few questions. So are you giving people the option to limit the amount they hear from you? No, that

[00:20:09] Chenell Basilio: was my first question.

[00:20:10] Dylan Redekop: Yeah. So that's like the first thing I would be like. Okay.

If you don't want to lose subscribers because they like, you know, two out of your four emails, they don't have the option to only get two emails a week versus four, because that can be overwhelming to people who already are signed up to a lot of things. So what I, what I like to see as an option from somebody who's sending more frequent emails is like, Hey, I actually only want the Monday motivation or the Friday fines or whatever version, you know, you have of those newsletters, or you can even give them like.

If you're doing a launch, you can give them the option to opt out of a launch sequence, which I do that.

[00:20:42] Justin Moore: I definitely do that. Okay.

[00:20:43] Dylan Redekop: That's amazing. Okay. So that's good. That's good. Um, but yeah, in terms of like the amount they hear from you, that could be something you could look at reducing.

[00:20:50] Justin Moore: How do I, how do I, sorry,

[00:20:52] Dylan Redekop: not reducing the amount they hear from you, but Making sure you have the option to

[00:20:55] Justin Moore: how do I, how do I, um, still want to be able [00:21:00] to launch stuff to those people who opt out of the normal cadence of newsletters?

You know, every couple months, basically I do a quarterly promotion or some, you know, new challenge or something. So do, do I also exclude those people from that? Or like, how does that, how do you think

[00:21:14] Dylan Redekop: I

[00:21:14] Chenell Basilio: wouldn't,

[00:21:15] Dylan Redekop: I wouldn't either. So what I think is you've got, my guess is you probably have specific types of emails you're sending on these days of the week.

Right. So you give people the option to, um, receive those or some of them or none of them or whatever it might be, or just one of them. And then when you do a launch or a promotion, those people still get those launch and promotion emails. They're just unsubscribing from the other three or four recurring weekly additions.

And then when a launch comes up, you're giving them the option to opt out of the launch. So again, they're not unsubscribing their preferences, stay the same. They're only getting that one or two emails a week from you that they want. And everyone's happy and you're losing fewer subscribers. And then when the offer comes in for your launch that they actually really want, they're still on your list and they still will potentially buy from you.

[00:21:55] Justin Moore: I think I'm going to do this. I've been resisted resisting this for a long time, but, um, I'm talking [00:22:00] to the experts right now, so I probably should do this.

[00:22:02] Chenell Basilio: Well, four emails is kind of a lot, especially if you signed up and you were only hoping to get sponsorship opportunities. So I don't know.

[00:22:10] Justin Moore: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Is that it? Just any other advice? Well,

[00:22:17] Chenell Basilio: are you doing like paid ads or anything to grow the list? I know you did before.

[00:22:22] Justin Moore: Yeah, so I did this pretty heavily. So I was, I was spending about 5, 000 a month. Actually a mix of Uh, paid meta like Facebook and Instagram ads, as well as spark loop, um, paid acquisition for a while there.

And that was going gangbusters that did really pretty well. And I was able to, uh, you know, I analyzed kind of the cohort engagement between organic subs and ones that I was acquiring from paid ads. And like the, the engagement was only about five, five to 7 percent less with paid ads, which was pretty sweet.

Um, and so. I definitely wanna like, explore going back into that, I, I basically re, I stopped paid acquisition for the newsletter because I, [00:23:00] I reallocated all of those funds over to, uh, a paid evergreen webinar strategy that I was running for about a year to 18 months. And so spent about a hundred k on, on, uh, cold traffic basically to webinar registrants.

Um, and so that was basically reallocated the budget to that. So, um, definitely kind of reassessing, you know, the, the strategy, one, one thing that I'd be curious, uh, of yours perspective, y'all's perspective is that, um, I've developed this audit tool that is sick, like it. So it's, it's basically, um, if you could, if you go to, you can check it out, anyone listening or watching, wanting to try it out, you can go to magnet.

com slash audit and enter in. Uh, your Tiktok handle and or all of the above. Um, and it will generate a personalized audit for how you can attract more sponsors, um, with your social media. Um, and basically I, uh, it's [00:24:00] a custom tool that I developed with, uh, with one of my friends who's a developer and it's so sick.

Basically we take a screenshot. Of your, uh, social platforms, uh, and like your videos and things like that. And we analyze how you can improve, whether it's your banner and your YouTube, uh, cover art or your bio, uh, or the thumbnails on your YouTube channel or the way in which you talk about yourself and your Instagram bio, whatever.

Um, and, uh, it'll tell you, Hey. Like, good job on this, but hey, you're making a mistake here. Um, and I have a feeling like this tool could be pretty powerful for lead gen. Um, and even running paid ads to it. Ooh, you got a four out of five, four out of 10 out of 10 out of 10.

[00:24:44] Chenell Basilio: That's great.

[00:24:44] Justin Moore: What are some of the like feedback that it gave you?

[00:24:46] Chenell Basilio: Yeah, channel banner image. It says add like new videos every whatever day. Um, Tells you about like cadence. About section is bad, which is fair. And then I [00:25:00] entered my email to get the rest. Okay. And now I gotta check out the email.

[00:25:03] Dylan Redekop: So this was, this is a, yeah, like a lead gen tool. Was that the whole motivation behind it?

[00:25:07] Justin Moore: Yeah, a hundred percent. Like, uh, lead gen was, was, but, um, I feel like having, Like running paid ads to it, even for like kind of an introductory creator, an aspiring creator, who is like, Oh, like I want to work with brands, this type of thing, um, might be pretty, pretty powerful. So I don't know. It's just a gut feeling though.

[00:25:25] Chenell Basilio: Have you done those ads yet or no,

[00:25:26] Justin Moore: not yet? No, I kind of, I kind of do

[00:25:28] Dylan Redekop: well.

[00:25:29] Justin Moore: You think so.

[00:25:29] Dylan Redekop: I think you've been shouted out on the podcast before also about talking about lead magnets and how you tried lead makes a lot in the beginning of the newsletter days. And you're kind of like, you kind of set them aside and focused on referral and locked content and that sort of thing.

Um, but now it looks like you're dabbling with lead magnets. This is definitely a different type of lead magnet for sure. Um, so I guess. Your mind and mind hasn't necessarily changed on it. You're just approaching it from a different angle.

[00:25:52] Justin Moore: So I, I was on Nathan Berry's podcast recently and we did the whole episode was basically about [00:26:00] how should my business change now that I have a book?

And, um, it was a really awesome conversation. And one of the insights that, that we basically had from the conversation was that I basically, we talked about what are the goals that I want now that I have the book? Like what are the goals that I want in the business? And, uh, one of the biggest things I told him was like, I want to make coaching the coaching program grow from, let's say 30 percent of revenue, which is what it currently is to 80 or 90 percent in a year or two.

That's a big goal that I have is like, you know, having the signature offer basically be our coaching program. And one advice piece of advice that he gave specifically came back to this audit tool was like, I would go hard on the audit tool. As like one of the major calls to action anywhere. Um, and depending on people's scores, you provide them.

Hey, you got a, you know, this score, you should read the book. This is great for you. Hey, you got to, or if you get above, you know, 90 percent or whatever, you're perfect for the [00:27:00] coaching program. So using the audit tool, um, as a way to kind of, you know, Harry Potter sorting hat idea of like push people to like different offers based on the score.

And so part of me feels like I should double down on making the tool really, really good. It's great. Now it's good. Now I want to make it great. Uh, and then develop kind of a sophisticated. Uh, segmentation, uh, logic on the backend to like show people different offers based on their score. I

[00:27:25] Chenell Basilio: think that's super smart.

It reminds me of, um, Brian Harris with growth tools and he had, he's put together five, six, maybe more of these like software lead magnets essentially. And he's been able to grow his list through those people share them all the time because they're free. Um, so this is what that reminds me of. I think it's.

a really good option. I think Nathan's right on point with that. Like sort people into different buckets based on how they're scoring. Um, yeah, I mean, it's the ultimate personalization and you have their YouTube channel link, their Instagram channel. Like you can do direct outreach if they're [00:28:00] quality enough.

[00:28:01] Justin Moore: So yeah. One other, um, I've toyed with is, um, that, you know, there's these, uh, lead gen companies out there, for example, like there's one called influencers dot club, for example, um, and they, uh, will have some like pretty sophisticated tooling to filter. Uh, certain types of creators or influencers. Maybe they usually work with creator economy companies to do cold lead gen.

So like email, cold email marketing. Um, and I would talk to them, you know, I'm still kind of considering whether trying this, but like I said, Hey, can you get me a list of like creators who you look at their. Profile and they've done at least one paid partnership in the last six months that you know, they look at you You see that they have like a hashtag ad or hashtag sponsored or something in their instagram post that's probably like a good person to like for me to reach out to and be like Either hey join the newsletter or oh, hey buy my book or hey sign up for this free, you know webinar or whatever Um [00:29:00] that probably feels like a good thing, but I don't know cold email outreach has Is it walk me through this?

Because I everything to date has been inbound for my business over the last three or four years, other than the paid cold ads that I tried. But like everything else has been like, Hey, like, I'm not saying like, Hey, buy my, buy my course or like, Hey, buy my code. It's like, everyone is kind of like coming to me and saying like, Hey, I want to sign up for this.

And so somehow cold email feels. Yeah. different. It feels a little ickier. I don't know. Am I wrong in that?

[00:29:31] Chenell Basilio: I don't love doing cold email either for that reason, but I'm sure there's a way to make it warmer. So it's not super cold.

[00:29:38] Justin Moore: Yeah.

[00:29:38] Chenell Basilio: Um, maybe you even start looking at, all right, so you've worked with this one person, see who they're connected to.

Maybe, I don't know, that's still not super warm,

[00:29:47] Dylan Redekop: but why do you feel the need to do cold outreach?

[00:29:50] Justin Moore: Okay. Because. If I, if I look at the customers that I've, you know, have joined my course, joined my coaching, this type of stuff, it is the people who are [00:30:00] actively having issues with sponsorships. They're like, uh, I'm in a negotiation right now.

I need help pricing negotiations, proposals. Like we crush, we shoot those fish in a barrel all day long. Like we're great servicing that those clients. But when I go to conferences or when I talk with most creators, most Business owners, the vast majority of people are like sponsorships. I don't want to do sponsorships.

Like I want to sell my own stuff or I want to do, you know, this type of thing. And I have a three minute conversation with someone like that. And I say, Hey, you know what? I actually think you should be looking at it a little bit differently. And then they go, Oh, wow, this is interesting. Maybe I should. Be considering sponsorships and holy cow that I get goosebumps even thinking about I, I feel like, like that is the vast majority of creators and entrepreneurs.

They think that sponsorships are like this icky process. I don't want to give up creative control. Like I just want to do this over here. I want to make ad sense on my YouTube videos and not talk to anyone, or I want to sell my own courses or products or whatever. Um, [00:31:00] and so. I actually think that the vast, vast majority, there's like a much, much larger Tam, right?

A total addressable market of people who I can serve and impact, um, who just aren't doing sponsorships right now. And, and candidly, that's why, that's why I wrote the book. And so, um, I just feel like there's. A lot of people I could help who just, it's not even on their radar.

[00:31:21] Chenell Basilio: That's interesting. I feel like there's more.

There are other things you could probably do. Maybe even like if someone buys the book, give them a free coupon to give it away to someone else. Like a new friend. Uh, cause maybe they're thinking, all right, I'm learning about sponsorships, but my other friend over here thinks they hate sponsorships. So maybe I should.

Offer them a free copy of the book. I don't know.

[00:31:41] Justin Moore: You, you want to, uh, sorry. I'm like, I'm like totally taking control of your podcast. Um, but, uh, I feel like this is interesting, right? Um, can I, can I share my screen? We can, if those of you guys who are just listening, if you're just listening to the podcast, come over to YouTube.

Okay. Cause I'm gonna, I'm about to, I'm about to show something cool. Okay. So this is my books [00:32:00] site and I have this thing up at the top of this banner called the 10 K copies challenge. And I've basically. Uh, this is partly a list growth, uh, uh, hope as well, but basically I have these milestones that everyone in the community will unlock once I sell that number of copies of the book.

So, for example, like we're at about 650 copies pre sold right now, and once, once everyone in the, you know, once I unlock. A thousand copies sold ever. I'm going to send this secret video to everyone. That's called how I responded to a brand that rejected my pitch. And then there's like different things.

I'm going to be doing some live, you know, workshops at 3, 000, et cetera. Um, and so, so far it's been working actually pretty well. Um, some people have actually told me in the email. Respond when they respond to the email, when they buy the book, they're like, I just had to see that number tick up and I was like, sweet, this is great.

And so, um, so yeah, so it's just like, I don't know, you guys could probably tell like [00:33:00] my, my approach to newsletters and growth and all that has, it's been this very kind of like test and learn type thing. Um, and so like, I don't know, I don't know if this is going to work. I'm really trying to get to 10 K.

Um, you know, books sold by April 21st, basically. Um, so yeah, I don't know. It's uh, I don't know. I have fun doing these like little tests. You've done a lot of

[00:33:20] Chenell Basilio: tests for sure. Um, I've seen that you change different growth channels. Your product suite has changed like significantly, I'd say. Um, and it's, it's honestly, it's inspiring because I feel like a lot of creators.

They do one thing. It's working okay. And they're like, I'm just going to stay with this because it's still working. But you are like, no, we're going to change this up. We're going to completely change how we're doing things. And it always, well, it seems to do well most of the time. Um,

[00:33:50] Justin Moore: well to, to clarify, I have tried a lot of different tactics to grow the list and things like that, but I'm still only offering the same one or two [00:34:00] products.

Um, I'm not, I, I definitely have taken the kind of strip mall versus skyscape scraper approach that Nathan Berry has talked about to heart very much trying to build the skyscraper, um, because it is absolutely hard to like, you know, build mind share, uh, over 10 or 15 products that you've launched. And so most of the tests I've done have just been.

Uh, more like list growth tactics versus like, let me, let me launch a bunch of different products.

[00:34:27] Chenell Basilio: Right. Well, but I could, I mean, even with brand deal wizard, we're doing it as a cohort now it's evergreen. Yeah. You need a little bit more time on your hands. I'm sure. Yeah.

[00:34:36] Justin Moore: Yeah. And

[00:34:37] Chenell Basilio: have a conference. Now you have those two things as well.

So I feel like you're, you are expanding it. Yes. The, the vertical and the topic is all the same, but it's just. It's pretty inspiring to see that. I mean, you even changed the topic. You could have still been talking about the business of creators. If you weren't, if you were too scared to change it over to just sponsorships and some people are too scared to niche down like that.

So I think it's, it's pretty cool to see. [00:35:00] Um, so yeah, I just wanted to call that out.

[00:35:02] Justin Moore: I appreciate it. I appreciate that. I

[00:35:05] Dylan Redekop: think this is a great time, uh, and correct me if I'm wrong, Shell, but I think this is a great opportunity to. Pick Justin's brain about newsletter sponsorships for people listening.

Like definitely things that we should all be doing that. We're not that you see kind of that kind of thing. If you're, if you're ready to take on a few of those types of questions, Justin,

[00:35:20] Justin Moore: heck yeah, let's go rapid fire. Hit me.

[00:35:23] Chenell Basilio: And before people tune out and they're like, I don't want to do sponsorships. Or I already have this locked in.

I heard Justin told Nathan Barry on an old podcast or in some video that when you had a 3000 person email list, you sold a 2, 000 sponsorship deal. And I was like, what? At the time when I had 3000 people on my email list, I think I was selling spots for like 150 bucks. So there's a big difference in the way that most creators like me do things and the way that Justin teaches so Zone out here.

Listen to his advice because it's good stuff.

[00:35:57] Justin Moore: That was a that was a juicy hook there I really like [00:36:00] that one, you know, okay, so can we talk about why that can we talk about why that is actually?

[00:36:03] Chenell Basilio: Yeah

[00:36:05] Justin Moore: So a huge part of being able to sell newsletter sponsorships well is being able to tell the story about why your audience is different than the other 10 other newsletters that they're evaluating.

I think a lot of people get really fixated on Uh, the, oh, the, the CPMs and the CPOs and like, you know, how many coming up with some formula of, uh, you know, what the open rate, the click rate and like all these calculators that they can find on the internet when in reality a big part of, um, you know, making more money with newsletter sponsorships is just being able to tell the sponsor that like, Hey, the people who are on my newsletter are different than, you know, if you, if you compare my newsletter at 3000 subscribers to this other person who has an identical.

You know, number to me, my audience is different. And so the story that I told in those early days and I still tell is that, uh, the types of creators [00:37:00] that are on my newsletter are business minded. They are trying to make money and grow their business. They are not screwing around on TikTok. They're not just making YouTube videos for fun as a hobby.

They are investing money in growing this as a business. And that is a very different type of persona. Of type of customer that you want to reach. Um, I use the same logic to get my course sponsored. I get the same logic to get my, uh, my podcast, my social media sponsored. I use the same logic to get my event sponsor games sponsored.

It's the same logic. It's like you have to tell the story of the attendee of the subscriber of the follower. You have to tell the story. And I think that this is the way in which you, um, can detach your rates from your number of subscribers.

[00:37:43] Chenell Basilio: Super smart. I. Yeah, I could see exactly why that works. Even just that little reframe will make a big difference.

You're right.

[00:37:51] Justin Moore: It also helps you clarify, like, okay, maybe, maybe I don't know the answer to that. I actually don't know what makes my subscribers different. And you know what you need to do? You need to ask them. [00:38:00] You need to, Do some surveys, learn more, not just about the demographics, right? Of like, you know, maybe you do have some high level stats of your subscribers with your newsletter platform or whatever, but like, no, I actually, you know, what I care about, I care about the psychographics.

I care about what, uh, types of jobs do they have? Are they married? Do they have kids? Uh, you know, what types of brands and products and services are they using and loving right now? You can ask them, uh, what, what's keeping them up at night? What problems are they having? You know, you, you may do a survey of your newsletter audience and discover that.

Wow. I actually, you know, maybe let's say you have a bunch of SMBs. Uh, those are the types of people that are on your newsletter. Um, and you do a survey and you realize, wow, I didn't realize that 40 percent of respondents of this survey are having issues with bookkeeping or they're having issues with HR or they're having issues.

What was something, right? That's not about the topic of your newsletter. And you, so you never would have thought to like talk about that or collaborate with a partner or a software tool like that. But now that I know that 40 percent of the people in my Audience. These SMVs are having, uh, bookkeeping issues.

I [00:39:00] better go out there and pitch a bookkeeping tool, a bookkeeping software and figure out a creative way to integrate that into, uh, into my content, to my newsletter. And the beautiful part about that is that you're no longer worried like, Oh, are my, are my subscribers going to be into this? Oh, you just, you just found out there 40 percent of them are having an issue with this.

So it's probably going to increase conversions as well for, for this opportunity. And so, uh, it's, it's a hit. So also think about how game changing of a pitch that is now it's no longer, Hey, I love your brand. Would you love to sponsor my newsletter? It's Hey, I have a huge chunk of my audience. Who say that they're actively having an issue with this, that the issue that your product product solves, I would love to expose my full audience to, to your, to your tool.

[00:39:42] Chenell Basilio: I love this. I heard you say something like this before. And so I actually took some of this advice and I went and I, um, surveyed my audience and I said, what tools are you guys actively using? And by far and away, number one was notion. So I need to get on my game and reach out to notion and get that sponsored.

But that was the [00:40:00] first step I took. Cause I was like, Justin is smart. He's thinking about different. Things like this. So I did it a little bit different, but

[00:40:05] Justin Moore: okay. Okay. So, so let's talk about notion. Can we talk about ocean for a second here? Um, did you see over the last couple of days that they did a full court press with this new feature called notion faces?

[00:40:17] Chenell Basilio: I did. I saw it yesterday.

[00:40:18] Justin Moore: Okay. So, um, this problem and I saw people actually like a bunch of people making posts about this that did not work at notion. So I think that these were like, you know, they enlisted an army of either affiliates or people to like spread the word, make posts on linkedin about this.

And so, um, you know, one of the things that you could have done was infer that, hey, you know, notions, you know, they're working on stuff all the time. They're, you know, they've got this You know, potentially, you know, I don't know. I'm going to infer that, you know, a couple months ago, six months ago, AI, that was the big thing that they were sponsoring people to talk about on podcasts, on newsletters.

Hey, notion has AI now X, Y, Z. And so, uh, were you to reach out and pitch notion for a deal, maybe you would have focused still on that AI thing, [00:41:00] but they would have come back and said to you, Hey, yes, people know about AI now, but guess what? Actually, we've got this new thing coming in Q1 called Notion Faces.

Would you be able to help spread the word about that? So you allow them, when you allow them the opening, basically to say, Hey, love the initiative here. Chanel, thanks for this data that people are really interested in Notion. We actually have this other thing we'd love you to focus on. Let's talk about a partnership.

[00:41:23] Chenell Basilio: And so, with that, If I were to do that, what are some other like, I don't know, unique things that you could quote, unquote sell? Like if I just am a newsletter creator, I have a newsletter. Maybe I have a small social media. Like, are there any creative, like inclusions you could pitch them on? Like, instead of just being like, here's three spots in my newsletter.

[00:41:42] Justin Moore: So, uh, anyone listening? Uh, this is your number one opportunity and your number one directive for me this year is you have to have at least one other channel, whether it's a social media platform, whether it's a private community, whether it's whatever it is, whether it's an event, an in [00:42:00] person event, whatever, you have to have something else.

To pitch these brands other than more other than quantity. This is the biggest mistake. I think that newsletter operators make when they're trying to pitch sponsorship packages. Maybe you do have packages. Maybe you're saying, hey, package 1, 2, 3, 4, 5. But the only variance is quantity. You're saying, hey, package 1 is 5 newsletter blasts and package.

Two is 10 luges of glass. And maybe the only reason that a brand has an incentive to pick a higher package is a price concession. So they say, Hey, you get 10 percent off, 15 percent off if you pick the higher package, the longer package, whatever. That's not that compelling for most brands. They don't, they're not going to really care much about that.

Um, and so the biggest, biggest change that you need to make here is tying The packages to the brand's goals. We're going to go down a rabbit hole for a second here, but I think it's important for everyone to hear. Most newsletter operators think that the only thing that brands and companies care about is conversions is clicks.

It's opens. It's the attributable and measurable things. That is only one type of a goal. That a [00:43:00] brand often has when they want to sponsor you. I call it my arc framework, a R C. So a stands for awareness. I have done deals with creator economy companies. When I asked them, what does success look like to you for this partnership?

They said, you know what, when, uh, anyone, when a creator, here's the word membership, we want to fit them to think of our brand of the name of our brand. That was the goal. It wasn't. New trial signups for our, for our tool. That was not what they said. They said they want us to associate the word membership with our brand.

And so that is a, an awareness focused campaign. Okay. It's very important to understand are in, uh, the arc framework is repurposing. So the reason, and when I say, Hey, what does success look like to you? They say, Hey, we want to actually take the content that you generate. Maybe this newsletter integration, and we want to repurpose this on our blog because we don't have a blog.

Our blog sucks. And, or we, we need. Social media content. We suck at that. We want to repurpose this. Maybe you have an Instagram or something as a newsletter operator. The final [00:44:00] C is conversion. Yeah, that's that one that most people think about, right? And so the reason is so critical that you understand as a newsletter operator, uh, what the brand's objectives are, is that your package strategy and your pricing has to change when you put these proposals together.

So yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Package one is going to be tied to goal one. They probably told you a lot of different things. Oh yeah, awareness and sales. And you know, we need a content strategy, like all this stuff. And so package one is going to be the five newsletter blasts. Perfect. That's going to be the, you know, the, uh, let's say conversion focus goal.

Perfect. That's tied to that. But package two, there's no newsletter blasts in that. Package two is I'm going to make five blog posts for you. That you go on your blog. I don't even put these in my newsletter package. Three is the awareness focus one. This is where I'm going to, uh, co lead, co host a webinar with your brand.

This is the awareness play where I'm going to, you know, I've got a podcast maybe. And, um, maybe I'm also going to put, you know, the growth universe [00:45:00] podcast powered by brand on the cover art of the podcast. That's an awareness play, right? And so package four, guess what? That's the one that includes everything, and that's the only way that they can accomplish all their objectives.

Is if they pick the highest package.

[00:45:13] Chenell Basilio: So you include all three different types of them in the pack or in the pitch?

[00:45:18] Justin Moore: A hundred percent. Yeah. Because a lot of, they're going to, almost all brands will say there's a lot of different things they want to accomplish with the partnership. Um, and for any, any, any newsletter operator listening to this and seeing like, okay, Justin, yeah, this is all good and well.

Um, but all the newsletters that all the, you know, brands that I'm talking to, all they care about is how much are you going to charge me? Cost per open cost per click. Like they, they're all this stuff. They just, it sounds great in theory, but. No brands go for this type of thing. Um, have you gotten on a phone call with them?

A lot of people are terrified of that. Um, have you had a conversation with them? If, is all you have a place on your website where they can click? Oh yeah, click here. Book these dates. Newsletter insertions right here to sponsor it. Is that all you got? Um, because I [00:46:00] guarantee you that if they can put a face to the name, if you can ask questions About what it is that they're trying to accomplish.

I guarantee you that there is this is going to lead to a larger conversation. They're going to be able to put a face to the name. Wow. Justin's not just a, you know, another newsletter operator here. Even if you're charging two or three times as much as this other person over here, they may just choose to go with you because it seems like it's going to go better.

Um, so, you know, this, this person that you're, that you're negotiating with, it may be their butt on the line. Their boss told them. Hey, you better hit this KPI this quarter. You better do this thing. And they may just spend a little bit more money just because it feels like an insurance that they're actually going to be able to do what their boss or their client has requested.

[00:46:46] Chenell Basilio: You just made so many introverts cringe right now.

[00:46:50] Justin Moore: Okay, you're right. And let me, let me, let me, let me wrap you in a weighted blanket right now. Introverts. Okay, because I know you love those weighted blankets, guys. Um, on a [00:47:00] phone call. I know you're probably. In your mind, you're thinking it's going to be like four people in suits on a zoom call and they're all grilling you.

Uh, so here's a way to avoid that scenario before these calls do research, make a list of 10 questions that you actually ask them. You say, Hey, I want to learn more about your market. I'm going to learn more about your product roadmap. What's going on in your product roadmap. What are you excited about?

Have you ever worked with newsletter operators before? If you haven't, um, or if you have what went well, what didn't go so well, um, what are your, some of your concerns about potentially collaborating here? Um, are there a new entrance in the market competitors that are, you know, uh, other supply chain issues, um, just ask questions, right?

Be interested in what's going on in their world. Um, the other thing is that. If you don't know the answer to something that they ask, say so, say, you know what? I don't know the answer to that. No one's ever asked me that. I will get back to you. It's totally okay to say that. In fact, I think that that engenders more confidence in people.

If, uh, if you're, if you're [00:48:00] truthful about that type of thing. Um, and so these phone calls don't need to be a gauntlet, an interview. It can be a conversation. The visual that I like to give is like a lot of people think that Negotiating with a brand or interacting with a brand. It's like you're on opposite sides of the table and it's contentious.

It's like, oh, like you need this for me and I'm this from you. Imagine you scoot your little swivel office chair around the side of the table. You're both sitting on the same side and you're looking at a whiteboard together. You're saying, hey, this is the objective. We're both trying to go from here to here.

How can we do this thing together?

[00:48:31] Chenell Basilio: Make it sound so easy. I like it.

[00:48:34] Dylan Redekop: I think it is, it

[00:48:35] Justin Moore: is if you buy the book sponsor magnet,

[00:48:40] Dylan Redekop: I feel like you're kind of, you've called out like just basically putting in, separating yourself from other people by putting in just some extra effort. I know it's that's simplifying what you're saying.

Um, a lot, and I don't mean to, to dumb it down that much, but it's like, if you just actually put in a little bit more time and effort into preparation, into your pitches, into what you can offer these people and research, it's just going to go that [00:49:00] much more further ahead for you.

[00:49:01] Justin Moore: Well, you know what? The bar is low.

Yeah. The bar is very, very low. There's the bars. The bars in the basement. Actually, because most of those that are operators, most creators, they don't want to do this. They want to have the stripe checkout. They want to have the calendar where you can click here and book. They want to have the pricing page.

It seems easy. It seems seamless. Uh, but if I told you that you could go from making a hundred dollars per insertion to a thousand per insertion by simply being able to have a conversation with the brand, would you do it? I think a lot of people might, and that seems insane. I mean, I've seen this type of, uh, transformation when people start employing some of these strategies.

[00:49:34] Chenell Basilio: If someone handed me 900 to get on a phone call, I think I would drop my introvertness and go do it. So yes, that's the one blanket.

[00:49:41] Dylan Redekop: That's the one blanket.

[00:49:45] Chenell Basilio: Justin, this has been awesome. Really appreciate you coming on here and chatting with us about sponsorships and newsletters. And I'm excited to, uh, come to the sponsor games event, uh, introverts.

It's a little scary that you're going to be asking people to do live [00:50:00] pitches, but I'm excited. I'm ready.

[00:50:01] Justin Moore: I'm so I'm so thankful and I just want to say like you were one of the first people who bought tickets and that Has meant the absolute world for world to me launching an event is super scary. Like I you know, I I have um Committed a huge amount of my own personal money to like make this, this event happen simply because I want it to exist in the universe.

I mean, sponsorships are like the number one revenue stream for like a lot of newsletter operators, a lot of creators, uh, and there's no event that focuses on this. And, uh, and so even as terrifying as it is to like plop down 20k on a venue and, you know, five figures on catering and all this stuff too, I, I think it's going to, it's going to be the start of like something really special.

I think, especially doing these things, practicing in real time in person. With other creators getting real time coaching, uh, I think it's going to be a lot of fun. So, uh, I appreciate I'm, I'm so stoked that you, uh, you're coming.

[00:50:48] Chenell Basilio: I'm excited. Um, if anybody else wants to join us there, you can go to sponsor games.

com, uh, go get the book sponsor magnet. com, or just simply sign up for the free newsletter at creator wizard. [00:51:00] com. Well, hold

[00:51:01] Justin Moore: on a second. If you, by the way, I have, I'm going to give you, if anyone, if you, any of you listen to this and actually sign up, tell me it was Chanel and Dylan that referred to you because I totally am.

I have an affiliate program for tickets, 30 percent commission. So I will, I will give you that meaty commission. If actually anyone. Like signs up from this. All right, let's go.

[00:51:20] Chenell Basilio: Amazing. Different way to get your podcast episode sponsored.

Amazing. Thank you, Justin. This was great. Thanks again, guys.

[00:51:30] Dylan Redekop: Awesome.